TOPIC: BBC IPLAYER: The penis extension clinic

It's just a safer and superior way to inject and in my opinion ....


@ Hoddle10

A few points.

- Using a cannula is no more difficult than using a needle for cosmetic surgeons with over 20 years experience.

- A micro cannula can be used at Androfill, if the patient does not like the idea of a needle, however the cannula is larger (longer) than a needle. Incisions are needed for cannula entry, bruising and swelling are greater.

You might be missing one piece of information.

The Australian doctor, who we are in communication with, injects much deeper we believe; above the Buck's, below the Dartos.

There is a good reason that he does this, the filler is deeper, so any lumps are better hidden, and there is probably less migration of filler to the Foreskin region (and associated need to dissolve any stray filler, which can be an inconvienience).

Both surgeons we use have extensive experience in open surgery on the penis, and are intimately aware of the anatomy, not from text books, but from performing surgery on the open penis.

Both surgeons were asked whether they were comfortable injecting HA at a deeper level in the penis, and both refused to do this.

The reason given when asked, separately, was that is it too risky to do so, they would be working blind with the micro cannula, unless they made significant incisions in order to see clearly what they were doing (which would defeat the idea of being non-surgical).

Neither Androfill surgeon will risk it. It may be that Dr O. has a safe method, if his method is better we will adopt it.

- We are the only clinic to have put a close up video of our procedure in high definition on the internet, to be critiqued.

The worst complication we have seen in over 300 procedures is filler migration to the Foreskin, which is easily dissolved using Hyalase.

It is probably fair to say that, aside from Dr Kim in Korea, we are the most experienced in performing PE procedures using HA.

- We invite other HA PE surgeons to post close up videos of their procedures, so we can advance the procedure, get it absolutely perfect, and prevent unnecessary surgery.

- Dr O. is a general cosmetic surgeon, and deserves respect for delving into an area of surgery unrelated to his usual practice. We are in communication with him about his technique, and when we are convinced that it can be carried out safely, we will adopt it.

We all have the same goal, providing the best result, with the minimum of risk.

When Dr O. publishes his video and explains what he is doing injecting at this level we will be able to objectively determine whether this is a better procedure, or not.

This is fearful! Apart from hoddle there's one other person who posted having done a procedure with them (the doctor). I wish there were more posts about PE in the UK.

Reklaw wrote: Okay fair enough, i didn't mean to witter on at you I just feel passionately about how shit this technique is.

We're on COMPLETELY the same page Reklaw, I think it's a shitty , pointless procedure.

I just focussed on the one big issue for me , that is, even if everything else goes fine (big IF), you're still faced with nothing but a very expensive , very temporary solution.

I really feel hugely sorry for these folks and after this dam program, I bet he has a waiting list full.

jogift wrote: T One person's opinion is not enough to doubt a practitioner ...

I don't really, I was trying to politely say , you're in direct contradiction with somebody who knows what they're talking about.

Does Dr. Gitt in Arizona use a micro cannula when he injects voluma?

The clinic promoting surgery on BBC in the UK is Moorgate, not Androfill.

Doctors performing the Androfill HA procedure (including the Penoplasty surgeon who appears frequently on the BBC), are free to provide surgery to other clinics if they wish to.

No patient has been sold surgery by Androfill to date. The Androfill site aims to dissuade people from taking unnecessary surgery, steering them towards safer and more effective non-surgical options.

Thanks hoddle, that's what I meant by "perfecting the techniques (currently) available" ...

"It really made me wonder what the people on this board are like! It's odd seeing how out of whack some guys priorities are"
Are you referring to the fact that they were already a good size and that all they cared about was being "huge" or having a "monster"
Cos if so I agree, if i had an average Girth I would never of persued Phalloplasty.
Or were you referring to the fact that there partner already seemed happy with their Girth? because if I had a partner who was happy with my penis I wouldn't touch it.
Also it absolutely blows my mind that in 1st world countries like ours their still offering such backwards techniques, by now all these doctors should have switched to PMMA or HA. Their fucking useless, it's unreal that a bunch enthusiasts like us know more about what works than all these urologists who have PhD's.

smalljay wrote: Dexter, if you haven't heard of this long term inflammatory response effect, you need to search the boards for 'FBG' or Foreign Body Granuloma - it is a known (albeit somewhat rare) occurence with PMMA.

That is the one counter argument to the last two sentences of hoddle's post - we haven't seen the long term effects of PMMA in the penis yet. A lot of guys might get bad reactions, but also they might not. From the research so far, it appears that a small percentage (low single digits) might - but if Dr. C's theory that injecting it below the outer fascia results in less/no FBG's is true, then that's a good thing.

We do at least know that fat in the penis long term is a bad idea, ineffective at best, dangerous at worst. imo, PMMA is also not that great, and something better will come along (maybe it's already here, in HA). But that's just my spoiled 2011+ view of things - for people like the old vets here, PMMA was kind of a godsend - never has there been something like it which could give you permanent gains with so few short term drawbacks (assuming things go well during aftercare).

I took a read of the FBG issue, I focussed more on the literature from sites like pub med and so forth.

Interesting for sure but risk wise, we're talking less than 1 in 1000 and of those 1, these seem to be linked to people with existing conditions such as HIV, chronic renal fatigue or similar.

What's also interesting is, in a number of the cases, there's no guarantee that it was even PMMA injected.

I think , it's an issue to certainly aware of but I suspect on the list of things to worry about, of which there are many , it's way lower than other concerns.

Reklaw, read the comment I replied for context on the "it works" statement.

Androfill wrote: [Caverject (Erect) is a great idea.
It is interesting to see that men can self-inject Caverject into their penis at home without supervision - with a needle the same size as Juvederm supplied 27G.

Needle is'preferred'over the cannula, when there is a good reason to change we will.>

So a good reason to change is arterial embolization. If you use a sharp needle you can potentially'inject a thick gel into a vessel which can block blood supply and cause Necrosis. The risk is small but we are talking about the penis here. Any fool can inject the penis with HA using a needle. It's easy. There is a reason someone like Dr Oates has taken time to perfect a technique using the micro cannula and it's patient safety. Also it should give a better result as the needle has to come in and out all the time, whilst the cannula doesn't.

The comparison with Carverject is a poor one, as Carverject isn't a thick gel and the idea is to inject directly into the corpus cavernosum. With HA care must be taken not to inject into the CC, hence a blunt cannula is superior. Also, patients are clearly shown how to inject Carverject safely by their Dr and they also have an online tutorial on the Carverject website. In that tutorial they are clearly shown where to inject and where not to inject. One of the key areas not to inject is the top side of th penis above the dorsal nerve and where the blood vessels are. Look at this screen shot:

No I was referring to the fact they were both focusing on an issue that was the least of their problems. They were both "characters" shall we say. It's not like they had it all in life but we're just lacking a good sized penis.

[can i ask you how long you have been performing HA?]

Surgeons have 2 years experience.

Caverject (Erect) is a good idea, borrowed from Dr O.

It is interesting to see that men can self-inject Caverject into their penis at home without supervision - with a needle the same size as Juvederm supplied 27G.

Needle is preferred over the cannula, when there is a good reason to change we will.

In communication with Dr O. outside the forum. The goal is the same, to advance the procedure and promote it as a replacement for more invasive surgery.

the Androfill website sells lig cuts right off the bat. - We offer it, then dissuade anyone from taking it. No one has taken any surgical option. This is the most effective way of reaching prospective surgery patients.

Reklaw wrote: "It really made me wonder what the people on this board are like! It's odd seeing how out of whack some guys priorities are" Are you referring to the fact that they were already a good size and that all they cared about was being "huge" or having a "monster" Cos if so I agree, if i had an average Girth I would never of persued Phalloplasty. Or were you referring to the fact that there partner already seemed happy with their Girth? because if I had a partner who was happy with my penis I wouldn't touch it. Also it absolutely blows my mind that in 1st world countries like ours their still offering such backwards techniques, by now all these doctors should have switched to PMMA or HA. Their fucking useless, it's unreal that a bunch enthusiasts like us know more about what works than all these urologists who have PhD's.

I suspect the medical doctors don't have PhD's, they have a MD (or version thereof). PhD is a Doctorate of Philosophy - which Educators typically have.

I think smalljay is in the of things. PMMA was a godsend at the time and now maybe, something better (HA) has turned up. From what I've read so far, even without considering the long-term risks, it was not a godsend. Androfill's (hypocritical) website and others in the medical field are beginning to attest to this. The attention seems to be moving towards perfecting the skills of HA. Those using the older methods are those reluctant to give up what they believe that they have become experts in and for the still ignorant clientele. This is clear, as Reklaw pointed out, that Androfill could have such a website recommending what it has but carrying out the procedures brought out at the start of this thread.