TOPIC: Measurable/Qualitative diff's b/w 10% and 20%?

One can bet that there will be a continued loss up until the 6-8 month mark. Most of my gains from R1 were lost during the 4th month.

Does 20% PMMA generally predict higher gains than 10%? Are there different qualitative aspects to each, such as density post-collagen production, hardness, smoothness, etc.?

Thanks HC and M7, I had R2 last week. With all the attrition, I wonder how man rounds it will take for lasting results of 6". Pics, soon.

In my opinion it's very much dependant on the amount of collagen produced by each bead. On smaller surface areas I think volume will be the same with 10% andn 20%, but density greater with 20%. But on larger surface areas the beads become too spread out with lower concentrations and thus aren't as effective. It seems to me that guys around the 4.5" Girth mark can get just as good results with 10%, as 20%. But once the Girth gets closer to 5" it seems the 10% isn't so effective. From what I've observed, I don't think 10% should be used for second session unless it'sn to smooth things out.

HunkChunk wrote: I can confirm attrition after the 10 week mark. My first round with mainly low, possibly mixed concentrations - I expect to know what was used when I go in for my 2nd round - did diminish in Girth. The base was quite large and is now less wide, the shaft is also thinner. I lost approximately one third of the gains made

@HCWhat was your (BEG, MSEG) initial Girth, 6 week Girth and current Girth? Just to quantify what you are saying.

At 20cc's of 10%, I gained .5" (Wk5). What can I predict based on this result with a R2 of 15 cc's at 20%, 20 cc's at 10%, or 20 cc's at 20%?

I did a modest amount of research charting 20 members form the old and this board before making my decision. The data is clearly incomplete and therefore anecdotal but for that small sample size it appears that for first round the median appears to be ~.5' for 20cc of 10% and ~.75' for 20cc of 20% at the 6 week mark!Wade confirmed that those numbers sounded right but cautioned that he saw large variability in individual outcomes.IMO 20cc of 10% = 0.5' and 20cc of 20% = 0.75' are reasonable ballpark expectations at the 6 week mark for first round sessions.

Thank you all for this useful information.

I am starting Girth 5" (length, 6.7-7.1"), so w/in parameters of larger surface-area set by Hoddle, which would make me a better candidate for 20% R2, if maximizing gains were my goal.

In my case, at 4.9 weeks, with 20cc's at 10% for R1, I am at average Girth of +.6" . At current rate, I expect to be +.5", consistent w/ EQ's summary. As my favorite Girth is 5.75", and my range of joy is w/in 5.75-6.0", I am left to either extrapolate from EQ's data or wait til -- and hope -- he posts some R2+6 weeks round-ups.

If greater surface area renders 10% less effective in R2, and aesthetics increase w/ 20%, then I wonder if 20% at lower volume of 12-15 cc's would offer .4" in my so-far stereotypical cEditase.

I think there's enough data on these boards to make some very reliable predictions already.

Skeptical One wrote: In my experience, 20% yielded more than 10%, but the explanation as to why is not as entirely clear since I've seen some decent gains with 10% from other members.

According to Dr. C's office, there is a correlation with smoothness & other aesthetics when the concentration goes up.

I don't think we've seen many members have decent gains when 10% is used for the second session, which suggests there aren't enough beads to stimulate a sufficient reaction. On second sessions some PMMA must be being injected into the new PMMA tissue formed after the intial injection and also the surface area will be greater. I think this is why often second sessions when using 10% yield poor gains.

GSXR750 was one of the first to get PMMA @20%. He had excellent gains. then Dr C's office started doing 10% and it seems to me, without actually plotting the data, that most guys did not get satisfactory results with 10% including me. If I am to do it all over again, I would request 20% for rnd 1 and 2 and then 10% for touch up in rnd 3. I got about .2" to .25" from the first rnd and about .4" to .45" from the 2nd rnd and now I await the results of rnd 3 but so far it looks good.

I think we, including Dr C' office are still learning this PMMA thing and in a couple more years we should have enough data to be able to be more aggressive with the concentration and the amount of CC's injected. But I have to say it is better to take easy till we know more facts.

@Zayne
I can confirm attrition after the 10 week mark. My first round with mainly low, possibly mixed concentrations - I expect to know what was used when I go in for my 2nd round - did diminish in Girth. The base was quite large and is now less wide, the shaft is also thinner. I lost approximately one third of the gains made, which is still an honorable premium which I would have fully appreciated had it been all I had gotten, but the early gains got me "addicted" and it was too grand having a hefty wanger that the ladies said they LOVED. Since it slimmed down, one said that she wouldn't mind if it got thicker again like last fall... So I'm off to round two as soon as I can travel the 5700 miles to see Dr C.
Cheers,
HC

I'm also interested to know how much the product stays in one area right after injection? I've had 2 rounds of 10% and have a few areas about the size of a thumb that need to be filled in. Would it be better to use the 20% in round 3 with the understanding it may stay more in those particular spots and not spread out? This is just my theory and I'd appreciate anyone elses information regarding this.

hoddle10 wrote:

Skeptical One wrote: In my experience, 20% yielded more than 10%, but the explanation as to why is not as entirely clear since I've seen some decent gains with 10% from other members.

According to Dr. C's office, there is a correlation with smoothness & other aesthetics when the concentration goes up.

I don't think we've seen many members have decent gains when 10% is used for the second session, which suggests there aren't enough beads to stimulate a sufficient reaction. On second sessions some PMMA must be being injected into the new PMMA tissue formed after the intial injection and also the surface area will be greater. I think this is why often second sessions when using 10% yield poor gains.

Not many, but I do recall some having modest gains with the 10%. But I think you are right with 10% not being as successful on 2nd rounds.

In my experience, 20% yielded more than 10%, but the explanation as to why is not as entirely clear since I've seen some decent gains with 10% from other members.

According to Dr. C's office, there is a correlation with smoothness & other aesthetics when the concentration goes up.

@Big John
Thank you for your advice about waiting 6 months. I will be watching closely your your and others' results to see how typical attrition is, and at what percentage. Hopefully, final gains will reveal themselves to be typically stabilized by 3rd month or earlier. We have already seen 2 members for which this was not the case, and fluctuations occurred after 3 months, if I am correct.

I found this post by Supa on the old boards, and used it to pre-calculate that it would be best for me to re-apply 20 cc's at 10% to reach my goal of b/w 5.75 and 6.0.

Supa:
"A basic mathematical approach to justabitmore's conjecture.

Let's assume that the penis is a right circular cylinder. Then the volume of the erected penis is given by:

V = (1/4pi) x (erected length) x (Girth) x (Girth).

By applying the above formula it can be shown that Bill enjoys an increase in volume of 56% whereas Bob's volume increases by 21%."

I was a C student in math, so I'll just give it a shot at the risk of looking very dumb.

Pre-R1:
V =.25(3.14) x 7 x 5 x 5
V = 137.38

Currently 6 at base; 5.4 to 5.7 shaft measurements, depending on where along the shaft:

Forecasted Final Results (fool's bet, I know):
V = .25(3.14) x 7 x 5.5 x 5.5
V = 166.22

Gain from R1 (predicted): V = 28.84

I then calculated what increase in volume I would need to obtain 5.85 (safer than shooting for 5.75):

Desired Gain in Volume = 166.22 (current vol.) + G (gained vol. needed) = .25(3.14) x 7 x 5.8 x 5.85

G = 22.88

So, if R1 at 20 cc's of 10% brought me volume of 28.84, then should I be able to obtain 5.75 - 6.0 with a similar volume and 10% solution?