TOPIC: LL's Lig Cut Journal and Progress Report

Penis Lengthening Surgery Journal and Progress Report
BackgroundHave been practicing PE 'on and off ' for 6 years. I have utilized a penis extender with good temporary results, manual exercises/beginners routines etc, penis pumping consistently for 6 years and Hanging with both a Bib and Vacuum and an ESL40 ADS. Having tried most techniques for PE I was able to gain about .5' permanent Flaccid and .25 Inch Erect. The one variable is my Flaccid, which will increase when actively stretching or Hanging by about another .25 inches to 4.5" but will retract when not Hanging or stretching back to 4.0-4.25". MeasurementsBeginning FL 3.5'FGMS 4.5'FGBS 5.0'NBPEL 6'BPEL 6.75'MSEG 5.5'BSEG 6.0'Ending PEFL 4.0-4.25'NBPEL 6.25'BPEL 7.1'MSEG 5.5'BSEG 6.0'Current Post OpFL 4.5' I feel I have made decent gains considering there are many men on this forum who gain nothing. I have accepted that gains for me also come in very small increments and slowly. All factors considered, I made a personal decision to have my ligs cut. My main focus from the beginning of starting PE was to increase my Flaccid length. It has been something that has bothered me since adolescence. I have a muscular build and large thighs which have always given the illusion of a smaller penis even though my Flaccid measurements are average to above average. I have pumped for 6 years and this would generally increase my Flaccid hang to 5.0 Girth by 4.5 in length, which made me feel very confident in shower/gym or social nude situations (my wife and I are naturists). It just becomes rather inconvenient to pump everyday or in situations where privacy is limited. This also contributed to my decision for a procedure which could provide more long term length and most importantly 'confidence'!! In my personal experience when I would refrain from PE I could lose as much as .5 inches in Flaccid gains, sometimes retracting to 3.9'. This became very discouraging and especially while palpating I could locate the fact that I had very prominent and thick suspensory ligaments which ran medially but mainly laterally on the base of shaft. I finally became convinced I wanted to remove what I thought was the problem and see if it worked. My research with members and Dr. Rosenthal, noted very small side effects if any from the modern technique of this surgery (1" horizontal incision), so I had the resources and the will and decided to finally have it done. I am blessed with a very supportive wife and she was very supportive in my decision. The procedureEverything is very well orchestrated and I was taken to a pre-op room greeted by a nurse and given instructions on recovery. Shortly there after the Anesthesiologist came in and introduced himself. He is extremely well regarded and is very personable and gives you a good feeling that you are in very competent hands. Lastly Dr. Rosenthal came in, did a quick pre op exam, goes over the game plan and that's it. Wheeled me into the surgery room, blood was pumping! Felt my head get a little tingly, said 'whoa'. Woke up 3 hours later in recovery. The anesthesiologist also had the courtesy to come out to the waiting area and let my wife know that everything went flawlessly. Only trouble I had was a little nausea from the anesthesia, which they quickly remedied with some IV meds. Day 1I spent the good part of the day relaxing in the hotel room trying to stay comfortable while taking Vicodin to help with the pain. My incision was greater than the expected 1', mine was more like 2' but this is particular to every persons Flaccid Girth/anatomy. My penis is on the thick side so the ligaments are therefore at wider points. The stitches were done very cleanly with only 1 high point, I anticipate it will heal very well. Pain was tolerable and honestly I took the Vicodin as a precautionary measure once the nerve block in my penis wore off. A drain was placed above the incision to help control the fluid and swelling, this was the biggest source of discomfort or any pain. I found it very difficult to move or sleep with this drain in. That night I also had uncontrollable erections that were very firm. So any talk that this surgery would ruin my Erection all together or make it weaker was not true for me after the first night. These erections were painful though and they prevented me from sleeping most of the night. First night I slept approximately 2 hours because of the drain, erections, and I am a stomach sleeper which is impossible post op. Day 2Swelling was very prevalent day 2 and had terrible itching in my scrotum due to swelling. Drainage was manageable and incision was healthy. The pain was very manageable and I elected to only take Advil. A follow up appointment was scheduled that morning with the Dr. and he examined everything and removed the drain (which hurt like a bitch). Instructions were given for dressing changes, Hanging and general post op care. Those wondering, The Grip and the LG Hanger were suggested. The rest of the day once again stayed off my feet, rested and remained hydrated. Pain was very manageable and relatively non existent after the drain was removed. Due to swelling and dressing it was hard to tell but my wife confirmed it looked approximately .5' longer, which is what I had estimated as well. This was not very important as many men actually can retract after surgery so any gain at this point was a good sign. Dr. Rosenthal even mentioned after the procedure that you may not notice any gain until you begin Hanging. In my case my penis definitely now hung about 1' below my testicles, previously it was about .25 to .50' beyond them. Hard to get a good measurement right now due to pelvic swelling but it appears to be 4.5' Flaccid. Rough night sleeping again due to having to sleep flat on my back. Further updates will come at more import points in the healing process, including Erect gains which I am not concerned about but I am sure members are interested in. But I mainly thought that this information could be useful for men who were curious about details surrounding the immediate procedure. It's also suggested to refrain from heavy lifting and exercise, masturbating and sex for 1 month and also to take 1 week off from work. Hanging allowed to begin at 3-4 weeks post op, depending on ones incision health and pain level.The surprising thing about this surgery is that there is no protocol given to you by the surgeon regarding post op rehab/Hanging, only wound care. The Hanging program is mainly left up to the individual. It would be my highest suggestion to anyone who is considering having this procedure done, to be very familiar with Hanging and general PE. An uneducated injury or improper usage of equipment could yield poor results due to this procedure relying heavily on post op Hanging!

Attached pictures: First is 1 hour pre-op. Last 2 are same day post-op.
More to come..Regards!LL

Looking good, LL. My advice, after having done this 20 years ago, as soon as the doctor clears you for Hanging, go for it with endurance in mind, as opposed to weight. Better to hang lighter for longer than heavier for shorter. I only hung for about 3 months, then stopped. Overall I would say I gained about three quarters of an Inch.

Thanks Ches. I will say though, any small gains I saw post op have now gone away. I would say I am now the same length Flaccid as before, maybe a fraction bigger. Were you someone who saw immediate gains right after surgery? Just curious? I went into this very well aware that Hanging would be very important but just expected a little more immediate gain I guess.

Day 5Very little drainage from incision now and pain is relatively non existent except for bending down to pick something up or standing up after laying down for a long time. Swelling is beginning to decrease but my penis still resembles a humpback whale! My nocturnal erections have now decreased and are no longer painful. The one major change I am seeing 5 days out now is retraction. I was told by members and Dr. Rosenthal that this would occur but it is still discouraging to see. My Flaccid hang is about 4.25' now, not terrible but still a bit disheartening to see. Something else that is a bit annoying is you are not allowed to shower for about a month because keeping the incision dry and clean is paramount! You are also given a round of antibiotics that you must take daily following your surgery to further protect against infection. Basically you have to take sponge baths and do your best to get everything clean. I use a damp wash cloth and then finish up with 2 different kinds of baby wipes. I shaved 'everything' off front and back before my procedure for this reason, to increase hygienic cleanliness. I have also implemented RIE (Rest, Ice, Elevation) to assist with reducing my swelling. My scrotum has definitely reduced in size since implementing RIE. Just resting, staying off your feet, soft cold pack on the groin and elevating the lower legs under a pillow. Day 5 has me feeling light years better and able to walk very normally, and move about without hardly any discomfort. 1 WeekPain gets better each day but the only consistent pain I have is when I stand up. It is not the act of standing up it is the change in pressure, it almost feels like the weight downward creates some pelvic pain. This pain goes away after about 15 seconds each time as your anatomy has a chance to adjust to the shift. My incision looks healthy and is finally beginning to scab and has practically no drainage. (Full disclaimer, I am not advocating my post-op process but merely sharing what I am doing.) My penis and incision feel much better and stable at 1 week. Retraction has definitely set in and I have begun wearing 'only the cap' of the ESL40 to prevent retraction and to give VERY VERY little weight and distraction keeping me at about 4.75-5' Flaccid. Now this is the reinforced version of the ESL40 not the standard, reinforced version is heavier. There is no pain or discomfort anywhere and most importantly none in my scar region so I feel very safe utilizing this technique. I still continue to use ice packs in the evening as there is still swelling present in my scrotum but most of it resides in my pelvis and penis. The nocturnal erections last night were very strong and once again they were painful. Previous night my erections were frequent but not strong or painful. That was not the case last night and the pain woke me up a couple of times and I needed to readjust. I was pretty sure my incisions would be a little angry this morning and maybe have a little blood but to my surprise I had neither, thankfully! FYI the ESL40 is sterilized after 'every' use, inside and out and paper tape is placed over my urethra while wearing it. Infection is something you do not want during this phase and I am taking every precaution.

Regards
LL

LatinLog wrote: Thanks Ches. I will say though, any small gains I saw post op have now gone away. I would say I am now the same length Flaccid as before, maybe a fraction bigger. Were you someone who saw immediate gains right after surgery? Just curious? I went into this very well aware that Hanging would be very important but just expected a little more immediate gain I guess.

Post-surgery it was only a fractional gain but after the Hanging, there was a considerable increase. you really have to dedicate time to this for maximum growth. I only hung for a few months but I've heard of others hang for many months and getting significant gains.

chester wrote: Post-surgery it was only a fractional gain but after the Hanging, there was a considerable increase. you really have to dedicate time to this for maximum growth. I only hung for a few months but I've heard of others hang for many months and getting significant gains.

Thanks for the reassurance!! That's what I had assumed. Aside from Dr. Rosenthal I hadn't really asked anyone about results right after surgery. Can't wait to start Hanging!

Week 2My testicles produced the most discomfort between wk 1 and 2, my testicles right after week 1 became larger and felt very heavy. So sure enough I experienced my first wet dream since the age of 15 this week. I woke up with patches of wet areas all over the place and one big puddle. I told my wife 'I think I pissed myself', but as time went on my underwear became hard, sticky and it was obvious what happened. Weird side effect of the no sex rule after this procedure I guess. Dr. R. reassured me that there was no danger in this and that nocturnal erections should not cause any issues with recovery other than pain when they occur. Today at 2 weeks though, all swelling has pretty much subsided. My Flaccid penis is all over the map length wise however. One day it relaxes and is 4.75' the next day it retracts and hides at just above 4'. Pain is pretty much non existent now and that includes erections unless I'm sleeping in a funny position. The only negatives that I can see so far are that I am developing a keloid scar on the left half of my incision. In my first post I noted that Dr. R. had left 1 high point on the incision. This was basically an area of stitches which seemed bunched and a little loose. Well these have now begun to form a visible scar. I am waiting for all the scabs and any sign of redness to disappear before I begin using Bio Oil and Scar Gel on my incision, but this generally does a good job on reducing scars for post op patients in my experience. One thing I have also noticed, as well as my wife, is my scrotum is very frequently more relaxed and seems to hang lower. I am wondering if the Fundiform may have been effected during my surgery, which is believed to help suspend the scrotum?RegardsLL

Week 3Well, week 3 has not been as happy and cheery. During this period I had considerable swelling and discomfort on the right side of my penis base and internally which seemed to be getting worse. I also developed thrombosed veins on the right side of my penis which seemed to come from this area. While I was in contact with Dr. Rosenthal about all this I developed an opening in part of my incision with blood and clear discharge as well. Thankfully the previous day Dr. Rosenthal had already called in a second round of antibiotics. As far as the veins go, he has suggested ibuprofen and warm compresses. Since starting the antibiotics I have also refrained from showering again and have been applying light dressings to the incision area and keeping it very dry and clean. I am not sleeping on my stomach anymore, as I believe the combination of sleeping on my stomach and having very frequent erections irritated the incision scar and internal structure, possibly. I am literally 1 week away from being able to hang, but honestly unless things drastically change I may have to put it off for another 2 weeks. I keep telling myself this isn't the end of the world because many men get lengthening and widening at the same time and they are not allowed to hang for 6 weeks and seem to get their additional length. The good thing also is that I have not lost any length yet and appear to still have about a ' Inch gain in the Flaccid. Dr. R has not addressed what is going on at all. He has only given instructions on treating my issues. After 3 days of the antibiotics and Ibuprofen things do seem to be improving. The tiny area of incision is scabbing well and there is little to no drainage today. The groin pain on the right side has also diminished quite a bit. The thrombosed veins are also shrinking in size and the right side of my penis no longer has a large bulge MS from the dorsal vein. The veins are still hard as they exit the body and for about ' Inch of the penis. Only other thing that really sucks is my wife has just returned from being gone for over a week and asked if we can have sex immediately when she got back? I had to tell her what was going on. This has also made it very hard, she wants me to get healthier foremost but I can also tell she is a bit anxious. It was actually way better with her being gone because my wife is extremely well surgically endowed and just looking at her getting ready in the morning or walking around the house nude makes me want to shoot myself!!! The last thing I need right now are erections with this small spot in my incision trying to heal and these thrombosed veins. Prayers guys!! Hopefully next update will be better news!Regards,LL

Week 4-5

Everything seems to have cooled off and the inflammation and veins have pretty much returned to normal. I was religious for 1.5 weeks of taking 600 mgs of ibuprofen 3 times a day and 1200 mg of fish oil 1 x day. I refrained from sex, manual stimulation and sleeping on my stomach as well. Things feel much better now and my incision is strong and healthy and I have begun Hanging. Only thing I've noticed is that previously after Hanging my Flaccid would be about 4.5 inches for 5 minutes or so afterwards. Now, after a good Hanging and a tug, it easily rests at above 5 inches Flaccid for quite a while. Nothing else very substantial to note right now as I have just begun Hanging this week and don't expect any permanent Flaccid gains to cement until several months down the road. Today I did wear my ADS for this first time as well. Was able to have sex for the first time this week also.

Regards.

LL

Ok,
In the hope that this info will be beneficial to someone researching in the present or future I will give an update. I have had several set backs that are possible during this surgery. Men need to understand these are actually very possible. I experienced an infection, slight opening/slow healing in the left side of my incision and thrombosed veins in my penis. Which all prevented me from Hanging right away at 4 weeks. Clarification the thrombosed veins developed on another side of my penis and this was right after my last post. In total I had to rest approximately 6-7 weeks before I could hang. I was concerned that having to wait this long would be very detrimental but we shall see. As of now with regular Hanging 2 hours a day for the past 2 weeks religiously, I am up to 7 lbs and this feels like my previous weight of 12lbs pre surgery. Hanging just feels completely different, I can now feel a deep stretch on the lateral and occasional underside of my shaft at the point it attaches to the pelvis. Previously I would mainly only feel it on my very thick suspensory lig up top. I have not had to move up in weight yet as my Flaccid penis is beginning to relax at an elongated state very frequently and I also feel the effects of a deep stretch at this weight after 25 mins. I will not move up until things change. As for the numbers, they are already promising. After my last lay off my Flaccid was down a little bit with the scar tissue forming. With very little Hanging though (over 2 weeks) my Flaccid now never goes below 4.5 inches once again and when I'm very relaxed it is 4.75 and with a very light tug I am over 5 inches and looks great. My Erect length though is only a fraction longer about or less than 1/4 Inch but that's fine it's is not why I did this surgery. My Erection now measures 7.25 BPEL. The one cool side effect I would note but is a total optical illusion is my 3/4 Erection now does a gonzo nose, so the downward curvature makes it look way longer but it really isn't, well just very very slightly. My Erection at full however is still straight with with a slight upward curvature, basically no change in FULL Erection angle.
Regards
LL

LatinLog wrote: Ok,
In the hope that this info will be beneficial to someone researching in the present or future I will give an update. I have had several set backs that are possible during this surgery. Men need to understand these are actually very possible. I experienced an infection, slight opening/slow healing in the left side of my incision and thrombosed veins in my penis. Which all prevented me from Hanging right away at 4 weeks. Clarification the thrombosed veins developed on another side of my penis and this was right after my last post. In total I had to rest approximately 6-7 weeks before I could hang. I was concerned that having to wait this long would be very detrimental but we shall see. As of now with regular Hanging 2 hours a day for the past 2 weeks religiously, I am up to 7 lbs and this feels like my previous weight of 12lbs pre surgery. Hanging just feels completely different, I can now feel a deep stretch on the lateral and occasional underside of my shaft at the point it attaches to the pelvis. Previously I would mainly only feel it on my very thick suspensory lig up top. I have not had to move up in weight yet as my Flaccid penis is beginning to relax at an elongated state very frequently and I also feel the effects of a deep stretch at this weight after 25 mins. I will not move up until things change. As for the numbers, they are already promising. After my last lay off my Flaccid was down a little bit with the scar tissue forming. With very little Hanging though (over 2 weeks) my Flaccid now never goes below 4.5 inches once again and when I'm very relaxed it is 4.75 and with a very light tug I am over 5 inches and looks great. My Erect length though is only a fraction longer about or less than 1/4 Inch but that's fine it's is not why I did this surgery. My Erection now measures 7.25 BPEL. The one cool side effect I would note but is a total optical illusion is my 3/4 Erection now does a gonzo nose, so the downward curvature makes it look way longer but it really isn't, well just very very slightly. My Erection at full however is still straight with with a slight upward curvature, basically no change in FULL Erection angle.
Regards
LL

Thanks for the info LL.
I am very interested in this procedure and am pretty dead set on having Alter as the doc.

From my research they make this procedure seem pretty safe and effective but seems like you are running into complications?

My plan was to have my lig cut done as the same time of work done to pre-scrotal webbing. But sitting at around 5.1in EL I simply cannot afford to lose any EL.
Do you advise against this procedure??

First off, I must ask, what are your goals and what are your expectations? Going into this procedure you must have a realistic outlook on the procedure itself. Without knowing why your are considering having the procedure done it is hard to say whether I think it's a good idea? Secondly with any procedure it is totally a personal decision, mainly men on this forum offer their experiences and allow you to draw from that what you will. For me to say you should do this procedure seems very abnormal as it is strictly a personal decision. I will say however if you are looking to have this procedure to add Erect length then I would probably tell you that data and others personal experiences to do not back this up. In general it does not add much for Erect length Erect. As I stated, I did not have this procedure done for Erect length, I had it done to increase my Flaccid length because I was self conscious about it. Data does show that this procedure is fairly reliable for adding Flaccid length. Let me know if you have any other questions.

Regards
LL

LatinLog wrote: First off, I must ask, what are your goals and what are your expectations? Going into this procedure you must have a realistic outlook on the procedure itself. Without knowing why your are considering having the procedure done it is hard to say whether I think it's a good idea? Secondly with any procedure it is totally a personal decision, mainly men on this forum offer their experiences and allow you to draw from that what you will. For me to say you should do this procedure seems very abnormal as it is strictly a personal decision. I will say however if you are looking to have this procedure to add Erect length then I would probably tell you that data and others personal experiences to do not back this up. In general it does not add much for Erect length Erect. As I stated, I did not have this procedure done for Erect length, I had it done to increase my Flaccid length because I was self conscious about it. Data does show that this procedure is fairly reliable for adding Flaccid length. Let me know if you have any other questions.

Regards
LL

Actually it is more for Flaccid length. With the prescrotal webbing I do feel very restricted. Shrinkage gets embarrassing but when I am extended I feel the blood flows better and I have the "full" feeling.

The plan is lengthening and webbing to be handled by Alter. Afterward then possibly PMMA/HA.
If I could gain an Inch in both length & Girth I'd be pretty happy. 6x6.

If you are after Flaccid length then I think that data and users of this site have found that it is fairly reliable for that (0-1" gain) you could fall anywhere in between. I don't mean to be a downer but as far as Erect gains I think 1 Inch in length via surgery or procedure is pretty much unavailable at this point. I would say a more realistic number would be 1/4-1/2 Inch Erect through dedicated Hanging and possibly lig cut. I barely gained .25 inches Erect through 6 years of PE!! My lig cut seems to have barely given me about 1/4 Inch, however gaining anything Erect from lig cuts are not always seen. Everyone's anatomy is different though and it is very difficult to determine if you will gain anything. Also some men do not respond favorably to this surgery and build up scar tissue much faster than others and it can result in a shorter anatomy than before, food for thought. Also for anyone with some extra weight, weight loss is another successful method for making your penis appear longer.
Lastly if you aren't already Hanging I would suggest you try it. I did not gain Erect length until I began Hanging. If you go through with the lig cut your success is largely dependent on Hanging anyways. Knowing what you're doing before the surgery could greatly impact your success. Who knows you might get some Flaccid and Erect gains from Hanging alone and save yourself the 7-8K Alter charges for lig cut only!

Regards
LL

LatinLog wrote: If you are after Flaccid length then I think that data and users of this site have found that it is fairly reliable for that (0-1" gain) you could fall anywhere in between. I don't mean to be a downer but as far as Erect gains I think 1 Inch in length via surgery or procedure is pretty much unavailable at this point. I would say a more realistic number would be 1/4-1/2 Inch Erect through dedicated Hanging and possibly lig cut. I barely gained .25 inches Erect through 6 years of PE!! My lig cut seems to have barely given me about 1/4 Inch, however gaining anything Erect from lig cuts are not always seen. Everyone's anatomy is different though and it is very difficult to determine if you will gain anything. Also some men do not respond favorably to this surgery and build up scar tissue much faster than others and it can result in a shorter anatomy than before, food for thought. Also for anyone with some extra weight, weight loss is another successful method for making your penis appear longer.
Lastly if you aren't already Hanging I would suggest you try it. I did not gain Erect length until I began Hanging. If you go through with the lig cut your success is largely dependent on Hanging anyways. Knowing what you're doing before the surgery could greatly impact your success. Who knows you might get some Flaccid and Erect gains from Hanging alone and save yourself the 7-8K Alter charges for lig cut only!

Regards
LL

How is it going LL??
Any updates?